Talk:World Federalism: Difference between revisions

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Latest revision as of 17:15, 24 March 2023

A logistical nightmare.

- Have you ever heard about the subsidarity principle?

Have you ever heard about national-sovereignty and self-determination?

- Why do you post pro-PKK propagandas and disrespect the national sovereignty of Turkey but support Kurdish ethnic nationalism despite being a ‘world federalist’ (imperialist globalist)?
 Because even World Federalists are better at masking their imperialism than Turkish nationalists. BIJI ROJAVA, BIJI KURDISTAN

Page is terribly biased, especially for indigenous issues

This page was clearly biased to make this hyper-globalism look like it would protect the autonomy of all, and cites the UN as an example, but if you knew about anything about the UN you would know it is largely funded by the US and didn't do anything for native rights or land autonomy when it actually mattered. To ignore how UN laws actually work in practice is one example of ignoring the realities of such a system when done in practice. Especially when defending organizations like the UN.

Fuck the UN, literally the antichrist

this ideology is [removed], both in practice and in theory, since it's clear that the UN has been used as a tool for major imperialist powers to thread on the self-determination and sovereignty of nations, and that a one world government would clearly enrage the people of those nations as they're forced to obey a power that disregards their very will. -

- There can't be Imperialism if there's only one state left.

^Smartest Neo-colonialist argument, up there with "There can't be genocide if you already managed to genocide everyone else in the world beforehand."

Agreed

Disagreed

Well, you are wrong. Alt-globalism is the only truly based globalist ideology that genuinely cares for the well being of people across the world and helping to maintain their unique ways of life, the rest are neo-colonial lies trying to justify a one-world state.

^this but unironically -

Agreed! THIS IDEOLOGY IS LITERALLY ANTICHRIST!

I HATE ANTICHRIST I HATE ANTICHRIST I HATE ANTICHRIST

- Come and drink your Corn syrup already!

At least you are honest about it, will give you that

Cringe but it pisses off nationalists very well so it weirdly raps back around to being based

ditto above

- It isn't cringe.

Support imperialism and cultural genocide to own the nats!

- What?

Unironically yes

world federalism serves the neo-liberal pink capitalist system. [removed] system.

^ this take unironically, the UN is not only that, but also an imperialist puppet organization used by major powers to further their goals of hegemony -

- No it doesn't, Many of the most prominent World Federalists have been and still are Socialist.

^"Socialist". Also way to ignore all the neolibs and liberals apart of your movement. And also how the UN is very, very bad and imperialist as fuck.

Gigachad Ideology

- Global problems need global solutions, cope and seethe ultranationaloids.

^When you have to strawman anti-imperialists to be the 2-D ultranationalist racists in your head to justify and excuse enforcing your world-state to overtake the sovereignty of peoples across the world. Completely ignoring that you don't need a global state to promote cooperation and ignoring other forms of unity that don't need to enforce such an extreme system like alt-globalism.

Stop deflecting, if anyone if an ultranationalist it's you, since you are so dedicated to enforcing a world state where everyone must identify themselves with putting the nation (global nation) over all else at all costs including the cost to the national-sovereignty of others for some abstract idea of "unity".
TL:DR world federalists are basically just off-compass pan-ultranationalists with extra steps but deflects onto others who call them out on it.

- Honestly after listening to nationalists, I would start unironically supporting this just to piss them off

Embrace cultural imperialism to own the nats am I right?

- lol you literally call anything that is remotely internationalist "neo-imperialist" how about you look at a dictionary before you say this

Neoimperialists when they can't understand the difference between co-operation of peoples alongside global solidarity for working people and the colonized across the world of various backgrounds and cultures, and forcefully uniting the entire world under a single world state government (Often promoted directly from the wealthy and high-class European worldview and their values, ideology etc.) and promoting assimilation to enforce that world system. I am absolutely for international co-operation and solidarity alongside unity of the people directly, but the difference is that I am not some pro-globalization neo-lib who wants to enforce my worldview, understanding of morality, faith and culture onto others under a single understanding of FREEDOM™️ and DEMOCRACY™️. Maybe to you since your only understanding of internationalism is tied to your neo-colonial pre-conceptions of the only form of international solidarity being international subjugation. Which makes sense when you factor that your ideology is just a rebranded state-liberalism

- Well I don't actually advocate for this and as for my globalism, it's really only a long term goal. Short goal is internationalism. And I'm unsure how to respond to this rest to this considering it's horrifically biased like all your edits are

Says you kekw

- "Says you kekw" 🤓🤓🤓

- agreed with mattel

Maybe it is because you are both butthurt because my bias is not yours and because I call both of you out for your trash opinions. All your guy's have absolute TRASH edits yet I don't automatically remove them for "muh bias" because I am not a petty smug fart-sniffer who talks about how others are biased yet strawmans anyone who disagrees with them as radical-far-right ultranationalists if they dare question or disagree with my ideology. So TLDR: NEOIMPERIALIST SWARMS C O P E

Whataboutism at its finest-

- Just stop, you're making this ideology out to be more based than what it actually is

Keep fart sniffing and circle jerking. I ain't gonna stop you.

- fr though, imagine being such a douche that other cultural leftists hate you because you hate them for disagreeing with you, and yes, unironic critical support for cumraid AnAnonBoi

PS: I also find it ironic when a cucked succdem who defends selfish, elitist, and imperialist organizations like NATO and the EU like you calls out literally anyone that is remotely patriotic selfish just for being focused on taking care of their own nation, and no, I don't defend Eastern Imperialism, both the 1st world and 2nd world are [removed] and that they constantly legitimize each others' shitty imperialist struggle for hegemony, and yes, the UN is imperialist, and so is this ideology, the idea of a one-world state is a mistake to begin with

World Federalism

- “cucked succdem” says the cucked succdem . All socialism is internationalist cope.

^No it's fucking not.

World Federalism

- "I also find it ironic when a cucked succdem who defends selfish, elitist, and imperialist organizations like NATO and the EU" your argument would make sense if you ignored basically most of the EU's history. And as for NATO, you could've made that argument sometime in the 2000s before Russia started invading other countries. You unironically call them "neoliberal" organizations lmao, am I really supposed to be taking [removed] from you when you couldn't tell me what neoliberal means outside the first page of wikipedia? Probably not.

- wow I feel this is so chaos lol
World Federalism

- mfw somebody says that NATO and the EU, who had some sort of opposition towards populism, are both internationalist and opposed towards nationalism, promoted economic liberalism, and are pro-economic globalization, are not neoliberal

- ^^^^^^
World Federalism

- Keynesian economics serves as direct opposition towards chicagoan economics? And you're acting as if only neoliberals can support free trade? Like, what even is your point? You know there are socialists who advocate for internationalism as well? Would you call them neoliberals? Is literally anything that is remotely international neoliberal to you smooth brains?

- imagine supporting neoliberal organizations, such as EU and NATO while you’re leftist, Keynesian, SocDem, and Anti-Neoliberal.
World Federalism

- The creation of the european union was not only supported by socdems, but is literally supported by a lot of socdems I've seen. As for NATO, several of its leaders have been socdem's, and america flipping the bill for europe has allowed european countries to expand their welfare states and contribute to the left in europe. Like, what are you on about, i'm honestly just curious at this point.

World Federalism

- way to go having the audacity for your smooth brain thinking, since when did I call Marx, Lenin, and Castro, all socialists with at least some sort of internationalist ideals neoliberal? and imagine having such a retarded mindset thinking that anyone who opposes such organizations is opposed to internationalism as a whole

World Federalism

- Because you regard me as such despite being at a lot of odds with it? I would've just assumed at that point considering you regard modern socdems are neoliberals lmao

World Federalism

- The  embedded-liberal order was reliant on mutual capital controls to enlarge and maintain their welfare states, so to see you supporting  the EU so wholeheartedly felt strange to me, especially how internationalized capital could just move in response to the increasing working standards. The EU also took away each nation's ability to set its own monetary policy as well. 
 And sure, Clement Attlee might have supported the creation of  NATO, and the idea of collective security isn't necessarily bad, but NATO as an institution is very flawed. They invaded the third-world countries, even when the leaders there didn't do anything to the West. If it had to exist, it must undergo comprehensive reforms.

- World Federalism

- I'm not so sure if that one thing you said is correct. Membership in both the European Union and the Eurozone has been and still is voluntary, so that's like going into a steak restaurant and complaining about the steak. Unless you mean initial members who were looking for economic opportunities but then were subject to new legislatures issued by the more and more centralized European Parliament, then I see what you mean. Otherwise, I fully agree with you on NATO as well.

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 A logistical nightmare.
-{{UserPantheon}} - Have you ever heard about the subsidarity principle?<br>
+{{User|Pantheon}} - Have you ever heard about the subsidarity principle?<br>
 <b>Have you ever heard about national-sovereignty and self-determination?</b>
-{{UserApplethesky}} - Why do you post pro-PKK propagandas and disrespect the national sovereignty of Turkey but support Kurdish ethnic nationalism despite being a ‘world federalist’ (imperialist globalist)?<br> <b>Because even World Federalists are better at masking their imperialism than Turkish nationalists. BIJI ROJAVA, BIJI KURDISTAN</b>
+{{User|Applethesky2021}} - Why do you post pro-PKK propagandas and disrespect the national sovereignty of Turkey but support Kurdish ethnic nationalism despite being a ‘world federalist’ (imperialist globalist)?<br> <b>Because even World Federalists are better at masking their imperialism than Turkish nationalists. BIJI ROJAVA, BIJI KURDISTAN</b>
 == Page is terribly biased, especially for indigenous issues ==
@@ Line 11: / Line 11: @@
 ==Fuck the UN, literally the antichrist==
-this ideology is shit, both in practice and in theory, since it's clear that the UN has been used as a tool for major imperialist powers to thread on the self-determination and sovereignty of nations, and that a one world government would clearly enrage the people of those nations as they're forced to obey a power that disregards their very will. - {{UserNuoh}}
+this ideology is [removed], both in practice and in theory, since it's clear that the UN has been used as a tool for major imperialist powers to thread on the self-determination and sovereignty of nations, and that a one world government would clearly enrage the people of those nations as they're forced to obey a power that disregards their very will. - {{User|DarknightYuusha-11}}
-{{UserPantheon}} - There can't be Imperialism if there's only one state left.
+{{User|Pantheon}} - There can't be Imperialism if there's only one state left.
 <b>^Smartest Neo-colonialist argument, up there with "There can't be genocide if you already managed to genocide everyone else in the world beforehand."</b>
 ===Agreed===
-{{KaiserKlausMouse}}
+{{User|KaiserKlausMouse}}
 ===Disagreed===
-{{UserPantheon}}
+{{User|Pantheon}}
 <b>Well, you are wrong. Alt-globalism is the only truly based globalist ideology that genuinely cares for the well being of people across the world and helping to maintain their unique ways of life, the rest are neo-colonial lies trying to justify a one-world state.</b>
+^this but unironically - {{User|DarknightYuusha-11}}
 ===Agreed! THIS IDEOLOGY IS LITERALLY ANTICHRIST!===
 I HATE ANTICHRIST I HATE ANTICHRIST I HATE ANTICHRIST
-{{UserPantheon}} - Come and drink your Corn syrup already!<br>
+{{User|Pantheon}} - Come and drink your Corn syrup already!<br>
 <b>At least you are honest about it, will give you that</b>
@@ Line 33: / Line 34: @@
 ditto above
-{{UserPantheon}} - It isn't cringe.
+{{User|Pantheon}} - It isn't cringe.
 <b>Support imperialism and cultural genocide to own the nats!</b>
-{{UserPantheon}} - What?
+{{User|Pantheon}} - What?
 Unironically yes
-{{DragonRed}}
-world federalism serves the neo-liberal pink capitalist system. shit system.
-^ this take unironically, the UN is not only that, but also an imperialist puppet organization used by major powers to further their goals of hegemony - {{UserDNY}}
+world federalism serves the neo-liberal pink capitalist system. [removed] system.
-{{UserPantheon}} - No it doesn't, Many of the most prominent World Federalists have been and still are Socialist.
+^ this take unironically, the UN is not only that, but also an imperialist puppet organization used by major powers to further their goals of hegemony - {{User|DarknightYuusha-11}}
+{{User|Pantheon}} - No it doesn't, Many of the most prominent World Federalists have been and still are Socialist.
 <b>^"Socialist". Also way to ignore all the neolibs and liberals apart of your movement. And also how the UN is very, very bad and imperialist as fuck.</b>
 ===Gigachad Ideology===
-{{UserPantheon}} - Global problems need global solutions, cope and seethe ultranationaloids.<br>
+{{User|Pantheon}} - Global problems need global solutions, cope and seethe ultranationaloids.<br>
 <b>^When you have to strawman anti-imperialists to be the 2-D ultranationalist racists in your head to justify and excuse enforcing your world-state to overtake the sovereignty of peoples across the world. Completely ignoring that you don't need a global state to promote cooperation and ignoring other forms of unity that don't need to enforce such an extreme system like alt-globalism.
 Stop deflecting, if anyone if an ultranationalist it's you, since you are so dedicated to enforcing a world state where everyone must identify themselves with putting the nation (global nation) over all else at all costs including the cost to the national-sovereignty of others for some abstract idea of "unity".<br> TL:DR world federalists are basically just off-compass pan-ultranationalists with extra steps but deflects onto others who call them out on it. </b> <br>
-{{UserMatteel}} - Honestly after listening to nationalists, I would start unironically supporting this just to piss them off<br>
+{{User|Matteel}} - Honestly after listening to nationalists, I would start unironically supporting this just to piss them off<br>
 <b> Embrace cultural imperialism to own the nats am I right?</b>
-{{UserMatteel}} - lol you literally call anything that is remotely internationalist "neo-imperialist" how about you look at a dictionary before you say this
+{{User|Matteel}} - lol you literally call anything that is remotely internationalist "neo-imperialist" how about you look at a dictionary before you say this
 <b>Neoimperialists when they can't understand the difference between co-operation of peoples alongside global solidarity for working people and the colonized across the world of various backgrounds and cultures, and forcefully uniting the entire world under a single world state government (Often promoted directly from the wealthy and high-class European worldview and their values, ideology etc.) and promoting assimilation to enforce that world system. I am absolutely for international co-operation and solidarity alongside unity of the people directly, but the difference is that I am not some pro-globalization neo-lib who wants to enforce my worldview, understanding of morality, faith and culture onto others under a single understanding of FREEDOM™️ and DEMOCRACY™️. Maybe to you since your only understanding of internationalism is tied to your neo-colonial pre-conceptions of the only form of international solidarity being international subjugation. Which makes sense when you factor that your ideology is just a rebranded state-liberalism</b>
-{{UserMatteel}} - Well I don't actually advocate for this and as for my globalism, it's really only a long term goal. Short goal is internationalism. And I'm unsure how to respond to this rest to this considering it's horrifically biased like all your edits are
+{{User|Matteel}} - Well I don't actually advocate for this and as for my globalism, it's really only a long term goal. Short goal is internationalism. And I'm unsure how to respond to this rest to this considering it's horrifically biased like all your edits are
 <b>Says you kekw</b>
-{{UserMatteel}} - "Says you kekw" 🤓🤓🤓
+{{User|Matteel}} - "Says you kekw" 🤓🤓🤓
-{{UserTony567}}- agreed with mattel
+{{User|Glencoe13}}- agreed with mattel
 <b>Maybe it is because you are both butthurt because my bias is not yours and because I call both of you out for your trash opinions. All your guy's have absolute TRASH edits yet I don't automatically remove them for "muh bias" because I am not a petty smug fart-sniffer who talks about how others are biased yet strawmans anyone who disagrees with them as radical-far-right ultranationalists if they dare question or disagree with my ideology. So TLDR: NEOIMPERIALIST SWARMS C O P E</b>
-Whataboutism at its finest- {{UserTony567}}
+Whataboutism at its finest- {{User|Glencoe13}}
-{{UserMatteel}} - Just stop, you're making this ideology out to be more based than what it actually is
+{{User|Matteel}} - Just stop, you're making this ideology out to be more based than what it actually is
 <b>Keep fart sniffing and circle jerking. I ain't gonna stop you.</b>
-{{UserDNY}} - fr though, imagine being such a douche that other cultural leftists hate you because you hate them for disagreeing with you, and yes, unironic critical support for cumraid AnAnonBoi
+{{User|DarknightYuusha-11}} - fr though, imagine being such a douche that other cultural leftists hate you because you hate them for disagreeing with you, and yes, unironic critical support for cumraid AnAnonBoi
+PS: I also find it ironic when a cucked succdem who defends selfish, elitist, and imperialist organizations like NATO and the EU like you calls out literally anyone that is remotely patriotic selfish just for being focused on taking care of their own nation, and no, I don't defend Eastern Imperialism, both the 1st world and 2nd world are [removed] and that they constantly legitimize each others' shitty imperialist struggle for hegemony, and yes, the UN is imperialist, and so is this ideology, the idea of a one-world state is a mistake to begin with
+*{{User|ChronicLuna}} - “cucked succdem” says the cucked succdem [[File:Troll.png]]. All socialism is internationalist cope.
+<b>^No it's fucking not.</b>
+*{{User|Matteel}} - "I also find it ironic when a cucked succdem who defends selfish, elitist, and imperialist organizations like NATO and the EU" your argument would make sense if you ignored basically most of the EU's history. And as for NATO, you could've made that argument sometime in the 2000s before Russia started invading other countries. You unironically call them "neoliberal" organizations lmao, am I really supposed to be taking [removed] from you when you couldn't tell me what neoliberal means outside the first page of wikipedia? Probably not.
+* - wow I feel this is so chaos lol
+*{{User|DarknightYuusha-11}} - mfw somebody says that NATO and the EU, who had some sort of opposition towards populism, are both internationalist and opposed towards nationalism, promoted economic liberalism, and are pro-economic globalization, are not neoliberal
+* - ^^^^^^
+*{{User|Matteel}} - Keynesian economics serves as direct opposition towards chicagoan economics? And you're acting as if only neoliberals can support free trade? Like, what even is your point? You know there are socialists who advocate for internationalism as well? Would you call them neoliberals? Is literally anything that is remotely international neoliberal to you smooth brains?
+* - imagine supporting neoliberal organizations, such as EU and NATO while you’re leftist, Keynesian, SocDem, and Anti-Neoliberal.
+*{{User|Matteel}} - The creation of the european union was not only supported by socdems, but is literally supported by a lot of socdems I've seen. As for NATO, several of its leaders have been socdem's, and america flipping the bill for europe has allowed european countries to expand their welfare states and contribute to the left in europe. Like, what are you on about, i'm honestly just curious at this point.
+*{{User|DarknightYuusha-11}} - way to go having the audacity for your smooth brain thinking, since when did I call Marx, Lenin, and Castro, all socialists with at least some sort of internationalist ideals neoliberal? and imagine having such a retarded mindset thinking that anyone who opposes such organizations is opposed to internationalism as a whole
+*{{User|Matteel}} - Because you regard me as such despite being at a lot of odds with it? I would've just assumed at that point considering you regard modern socdems are neoliberals lmao
+*{{User|DuyQuangNguyenPham}} - The [[File:Socdem.png]] [[Social Democracy|embedded-liberal]] order was reliant on mutual capital controls to enlarge and maintain their welfare states, so to see you supporting [[File:European Federalism.png]] the EU so wholeheartedly felt strange to me, especially how internationalized capital could just move in response to the increasing working standards. The EU also took away each nation's ability to set its own monetary policy as well. <br> And sure, Clement Attlee might have supported the creation of [[File:Cball-NATO.png]] NATO, and the idea of collective security isn't necessarily bad, but NATO as an institution is very flawed. They invaded the third-world countries, even when the leaders there didn't do anything to the West. If it had to exist, it must undergo comprehensive reforms.
+**{{User|BeryAb}} - I'm not so sure if that one thing you said is correct. Membership in both the European Union and the Eurozone has been and still is voluntary, so that's like going into a steak restaurant and complaining about the steak. Unless you mean initial members who were looking for economic opportunities but then were subject to new legislatures issued by the more and more centralized European Parliament, then I see what you mean. Otherwise, I fully agree with you on NATO as well.