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Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism: Difference between revisions

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{{Ideology
{{Ideology
|themecolor = #f5dd02
|themecolor=#f5dd02
|textcolor = #141414
|textcolor=#141414
|title = [[File:Bhl.png]] Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism [[File:Bhl2.png]]
|title=[[File:Bhl.png]] Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism [[File:Bhl2.png]]
|image = BleedingHeartLibertarianism1.png
|image=BleedingHeartLibertarianism1.png
|caption = "I want gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns!"
|caption="I want gay couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns!"
|aliases =  
|aliases={{Collapse|
[[File:ProgBert.png]] Progressive Libertarianism [[File:ProgBertP.png]] <br>  
[[File:ProgBert.png]] Progressive Libertarianism [[File:ProgBertP.png]]<br>  
[[File:WokeBert.png]] Woke Libertarianism (Sometimes pejoratively) <br> SJW Libertarianism (Pejoratively, by [[File:Altl.png]] [[Alt-Lite]]) <br>
[[File:WokeBert.png]] Woke Libertarianism (Sometimes pejoratively)<br>
[[File:ArizonaLib.png]] Arizona Liberalism <br> BHL <br> [[File:BHLolbert.png]] Cuckbert (Primarily by [[File:Hoppef.png]] [[Hoppeanism|Hoppeans]]) <br> Heartbert <br> Wokebert <br> Nolanism <br>[[File:NeoClib.png]] Neoclassical Liberalism [[File:Nclib4.png]]<br>[[file:Pedobert.png]] Pedolibertarianism (in Poland)<br>
SJW Libertarianism (Pejoratively, by [[File:Altl.png]] [[Alt-Lite]])<br>
Liberprogre (Spanish,by Hispanic [[File:Altl.png]] [[Alt-Lite]] and [[File:Conbertf.png]] [[Libertarian Conservatism|Conservatarians]])<br>
[[File:ArizonaLib.png]] Arizona Liberalism<br>
[[File:Bhchilib2.png]] Bleeding-Heart Chicago School<br>
[[File:Bhl2.png]] BHL<br>
[[File:BHLolbert.png]] Cuckbert (Primarily by [[File:Hoppef.png]] [[Hoppeanism|Hoppeans]])<br>
[[File:Bhl2.png]] Heartbert<br>
[[File:WokeBert.png]] Wokebert<br>
Nolanism<br>
[[File:NeoClib.png]] Neoclassical Liberalism [[File:Nclib4.png]]<br>[[File:Pedobert.png]] Pedolibertarianism (in Poland)<br>
[[File:ProgBert.png]] Liberprogre (Spanish, by Hispanic [[File:Altl.png]] [[Alt-Lite]] and [[File:Conbertf.png]] [[Libertarian Conservatism|Conservatarians]])<br>
Coward Right (Same as above)<br>
Coward Right (Same as above)<br>
Snowflake Right (Also same as above)<br>
Snowflake Right (Also same as above)<br>
[[File:FemboyLib.png]] Femboy Liberalism (some)<br>
[[File:FemboyLib.png]] Femboy Liberalism (some)<br> [[File:Homobert.png]] Gay Libertarianism<br>
|alignments =  
}}
[[File:Libunity-yellow.png]] [[LibUnity]] <br>
|alignments=
[[File:Libright-yellow.png]] [[LibRight]] <br>
[[File:Libunity-yellow.png]] [[LibUnity]] to [[File:Libright-yellow.png]] [[LibRight]]<br>
[[File:Prgess.png]] [[:Category:Culturally Left|Culturally Left]] <br>
[[File:Prgess.png]] [[:Category:Culturally Left|Culturally Left]]<br>
[[File:Libertarian.png]] [[:Category:Libertarians|Libertarians]]<br>
[[File:Libertarian.png]] [[:Category:Libertarians|Libertarians]]<br>
[[File:Cap.png]] [[:Category:Capitalists|Capitalists]]<br>
[[File:Cap.png]] [[:Category:Capitalists|Capitalists]]<br>
[[File:Internation.png]] [[:Category:Internationalists|Internationalists]]<br>
[[File:Internation.png]] [[:Category:Internationalists|Internationalists]]<br>
[[File:Fem.png]] [[:Category:Feminists|Feminists]] <br>
[[File:Fem.png]] [[:Category:Feminists|Feminists]]<br>
[[File:Gay-2021.png]] [[:Category:LGBT|LGBTQ+]] <br>
[[File:Gay.png]] [[:Category:LGBT|LGBT]]<br>
|influences =  
|influences=
[[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] <br>
[[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]]<br>
[[File:Progress.png]] [[Progressivism]] <br>
[[File:Prog-u.png]] [[Progressivism]]<br>
[[File:Clib.png]] [[Classical Liberalism]] (Most)<br>
[[File:Clib.png]] [[Classical Liberalism]] (Most)<br>[[File:Soccap.png]] [[Social Capitalism]] (Some)<br>
|variants =
|variants=
*[[File:Laisvės partija.png]] '''Laisvės partija''' {{Collapse|
|influenced={{Collapse|
**[[File:Ecocap.png]] [[Eco-Capitalism]]
[[File:Liberaltarianism.png]] [[Liberaltarianism]] (Most)<br>
**[[File:European Federalism.png]] [[European Federalism]]
[[File:Glibr.png]] [[Green Libertarianism]]<br>
**[[File:Gay.png]] {{PCBA|LGBTism|Pro-LGBT}}
[[File:Libertfem.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism]]<br>
**[[File:Libfem.png]] [[Liberal Feminism]]
[[File:Socliber.png]] [[Social Libertarianism]]<br>
**[[File:Liberaltarianism.png]] [[Liberaltarianism]]
[[File:Steinval.png]] [[Steiner-Vallentyne School]]<br>
**[[File:Pinkcap.png]] [[Pink Capitalism]]
[[File:Yiannopoulos.png]] [[Kakistocracy|Yiannopoulism]]
**[[File:Soclib.png]] [[Social Liberalism]] (self-proclaimed)
}}
}}
 
|song=[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=llHhiiNnIjY&pp=ygUZdGhhdCdzIHRoZSB3YXkgaSBsaWtlIGl0IA%3D%3D That's the way (I like it) - by Dead or Alive]
|influenced = [[File:Liberaltarianism.png]] [[Liberaltarianism]] (Most)<br>
|theorists=[[File:PanAmer.png]] '''Americas''' {{Collapse|
[[File:Glibr.png]] [[Green Libertarianism]] <br>
*[[File:Jorg.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism|Jo Jorgensen]] (1953-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
[[File:Libertfem.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism]] <br>
* [[Libertarianism|Gary Johnson]] (1957-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
[[File:Socliber.png]] [[Social Libertarianism]] <br>
[[File:Steinval.png]] [[Steiner-Vallentyne School]] <br>
[[File:Yiannopoulos.png]] [[Kakistocracy|Yiannopoulism]] <br>
|song =
|theorists =
*[[File:LeftRothbardianismPix.png]] [[Left-Rothbardianism|Roderick T. Long]] (1964-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
*[[File:LeftRothbardianismPix.png]] [[Left-Rothbardianism|Roderick T. Long]] (1964-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
*[[file:Bhal.png]] [[Austrolibertarianism|Steven Horwitz]] (1964-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
*[[File:Bhal.png]] [[Austrian School|Steven Horwitz]] (1964-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
*[[File:Epistocracy.png]] Jason F. Brenan (1979-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
*[[File:Epistocracy.png]] Jason F. Brenan (1979-) [[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
*[[File:BrazilLivres.png]] [[Social Libertarianism|Fábio Ostermann]] (1984-) [[File:Cball-Brazil.png]] Brazil
*[[File:Libertfem.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism|Gloria Álvarez]] (1985-) [[File:Cball-Guatemala.png]] Guatemala
*[[File:Libertfem.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism|Gloria Álvarez]] (1985-) [[File:Cball-Guatemala.png]] Guatemala
*[[File:Socliber.png]] [[Social Libertarianism|Lilith Lovett]] (1993-) [[File:Cball-Taiwan.png]] Taiwan/[[File:Cball-US.png]] USA
}}
[[File:Cball-EU.png]] '''Europe''' {{Collapse|
*[[File:Laisvės partija.png]] [[Liberal Feminism|Aušrinė Armonaitė]] (1989-) [[File:Cball-Lithuania.png]] Lithuania
*[[File:Laisvės partija.png]] [[Liberal Feminism|Aušrinė Armonaitė]] (1989-) [[File:Cball-Lithuania.png]] Lithuania
|likes = When gay married couples protect their marijuana plants with guns
|dislikes = Socialism<br>
Authoritarianism<br>
Discrimination
}}
}}
'''Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism''' ('''Heartbert''') also known as '''Neoclassical Liberalism (Neoclasslib)''' is an Economically Right (usually under [[File:ChicagoSchool.png]] [[Chicagoan Libertarianism|Chicago school of economics]], mostly because it's more politically correct), [[File:Progress.png]] Culturally Left, Economically [[File:Cright.png]] Center-Right to [[File:Rightunity-yellow.png]] Right, [[File:Libertarian.png]] Libertarian Ideology who is the child of [[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] and [[File:Progress.png]] [[Progressivism]].
|likes=[[w:Rainbow Farm|When gay married couples protect their marijuana plants with guns]]
Heartbert believes that negative rights and [[File:Lfree.png]] free markets are compatible, and also complementary, to the concepts of [[File:Progress.png]] [[Progressivism|Social Justice]].  
|dislikes=[[File:Soc-h.png]] [[Socialism]]<br>
[[File:Sec.png]] [[Authoritarianism]]<br>
[[File:Racism.png]] Discrimination
}}
'''Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism''' ('''Heartbert''') also known as '''Neoclassical Liberalism (Neoclasslib)''' is a [[File:Prog-u.png]] Culturally Left, Economically [[File:Cright.png]] Center-Right to [[File:Rightunity-yellow.png]] Right(usually under [[File:ChicagoSchool.png]] [[Chicago School|Chicago school of economics]], mostly because it's more politically correct), [[File:Libertarian.png]] Libertarian Ideology who is the child of [[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] and [[File:Prog-u.png]] [[Progressivism]].
Heartbert believes that negative rights and [[File:Lfree.png]] free markets are compatible, and are also complementary to the concept of [[File:Prog-u.png]] [[Progressivism|Social Justice]].  


== Beliefs ==
==Beliefs==
Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism believes that the best way to empower the socially disadvantaged is through the upholding of [[File:Civlibert.png]] [[Civil Libertarianism|civil liberties]]. Economically, it ranges from a [[File:Soccap.png]] [[Social Capitalism|social market economy]] to a [[File:Cap.png]] [[Capitalism|free market economy]]. It sees [[File:Econlib.png]] [[Capitalism|economic liberalism]] and [[File:CultLib.png]] [[Liberalism#Cultural_Liberalism|cultural liberalism]] as going hand-in-hand with each other to achieve these ideological adjectives.
Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism believes that the best way to empower the socially disadvantaged is through the upholding of [[File:Civlibert.png]] [[Civil Libertarianism|civil liberties]]. Economically, it ranges from a [[File:Soccap.png]] [[Social Capitalism|social market economy]] to a [[File:Cap.png]] [[Capitalism|free market economy]]. It sees [[File:Econlib.png]] [[Capitalism|economic liberalism]] and [[File:CultLib.png]] [[Liberalism#Cultural_Liberalism|cultural liberalism]] as going hand-in-hand with each other to achieve these ideological adjectives.


== History ==
==History==
===[[File:Laisvės partija.png]] '''Laisvės partija'''===
===[[File:Laisvės partija.png]] '''Laisvės partija'''===


Line 68: Line 76:
Its ideals are based on LGBT rights, environmental preservation, carbon neutrality and control of global warming by 2040, fiscalism as opposed to tax increases, women's rights, pro-democracy, military service with civil service, pro-marijuana legalization, separate recognition of Taiwan and calls itself social liberal.
Its ideals are based on LGBT rights, environmental preservation, carbon neutrality and control of global warming by 2040, fiscalism as opposed to tax increases, women's rights, pro-democracy, military service with civil service, pro-marijuana legalization, separate recognition of Taiwan and calls itself social liberal.


== Personality and Behaviour ==
==Personality and Behaviour==
Heartbert within the comics is usually portrayed as a bit of an "SJW" stereotype within the context of other libertarians, meaning he will insist others not to use "politically incorrect language" and use the "correct pronouns".
Heartbert within the comics is usually portrayed as a bit of an "SJW" stereotype within the context of other libertarians, meaning he will insist others not to use "politically incorrect language" and use the "correct pronouns".


== How to Draw ==
==How to Draw==
{{Flag|BHL_flag.svg}}
{{Flag|BHL_flag.svg}}
Heartbert's design is that of [[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] with the snake replaced with a "Bleeding Heart".
Heartbert's design is that of [[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] with the snake replaced with a "Bleeding Heart".
Line 80: Line 88:
#(Optional) Draw some variation of "Don't Tread on Me" or "No Step on Heart"
#(Optional) Draw some variation of "Don't Tread on Me" or "No Step on Heart"
And you're done!
And you're done!
{{Flag-auto
{{Flag-auto|c1 = Yellow
|c1 = Yellow
|h1 = #F5DD02
|h1 = #F5DD02
|c2 = Black
|c2 = Black
|h2 = #141414
|h2 = #141414}}
}}


== Relationships ==
==Relationships==
=== Friends ===
===Friends===
*[[File:Progress.png]] [[Progressivism]] - My based parent.
*[[File:Prog-u.png]] [[Progressivism]] - My based parent.
*[[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] - My other parent who also understands that freedom and equality need each other to work!  
*[[File:Libertarian.png]] [[Libertarianism]] - My other parent who also understands that freedom and equality need each other to work!  
*[[File:Pinkcap.png]] [[Pink Capitalism]] - Yay! You understand me!
*[[File:Pinkcap.png]] [[Pink Capitalism]] - Yay! You understand me!
Line 100: Line 106:
*[[File:Libtrans.png]] [[Libertarian Transhumanism]] - Social progress in the hands of the free market!
*[[File:Libtrans.png]] [[Libertarian Transhumanism]] - Social progress in the hands of the free market!
*[[File:Libertfem.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism]] - You truly make my heart bleed.
*[[File:Libertfem.png]] [[Libertarian Feminism]] - You truly make my heart bleed.
*[[File:Anmark2.png]] [[Market Anarchism]] - He doesn't like to call himself a "capitalist" but he's still really cool.
*[[File:Anmark2.png]] [[Left-Wing Market Anarchism]] - He doesn't like to call himself a "capitalist" but he's still really cool.
*[[File:Civlibert.png]] [[Civil Libertarianism]] - He also wants gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns.
*[[File:Civlibert.png]] [[Civil Libertarianism]] - He also wants gay married couples to be able to protect their marijuana plants with guns.
*[[File:Libms.png]] [[Libertarian Market Socialism]] - I don't care about this whole co-op schtick, but I love how you too support libertarianism, progressivism, and markets.
*[[File:Libms.png]] [[Libertarian Market Socialism]] - I don't care about this whole co-op schtick, but I love how you too support libertarianism, progressivism, and markets.
*[[File:Helv.png]] [[Helvetic Model]] - Literally heaven.


=== Frenemies ===
===Frenemies===
*[[File:Libcon.png]] [[Libertarian Conservatism]] [[File:Conbertf.png]] - I may not like your cultural policies, but we still stand for liberty!
*[[File:Libertcon.png]] [[Libertarian Conservatism]] [[File:Conbertf.png]] - I may not like your cultural policies, but we still stand for liberty!
*[[File:Pop.png]] [[Populism]] - I like that you care about the people, but I don’t think your strategies are the best.
*[[File:Pop.png]] [[Populism]] - I like that you care about the people, but I don’t think your strategies are the best.
*[[File:Neoliberal-icon.png]] [[Neoliberalism]] - I'd like to think you're just a more moderate version of me, but that military interventionism of yours makes me think otherwise...
*[[File:Neoliberal-icon.png]] [[Neoliberalism]] - I'd like to think you're just a more moderate version of me, but that military interventionism of yours makes me think otherwise...
* [[File: Libsoc.png]]  [[Libertarian Socialism]] - STINKY SOCIALIST!!! But at least you're a libertarian and socially progressive.
* [[File:Libsoc.png]]  [[Libertarian Socialism]] - STINKY SOCIALIST!!! But at least you're a libertarian and socially progressive.
*[[File:Statlib.png]] [[State Liberalism]] - I applaud your advocacy for the LGBTQ community. You are also a capitalist which is cool too.  But you take things WAY too far. You also need cut the authoritarian sh*t.
*[[File:Statlib.png]] [[State Liberalism]] - I applaud your advocacy for the LGBTQ community. You are also a capitalist which is cool too.  But you take things WAY too far. You also need cut the authoritarian shit.
*[[File:Annil.png]] [[Anarcho-Nihilism]] - You don't give a f*** about liberty, equality and justice, but we both like guns and drugs.
*[[File:Annil.png]] [[Anarcho-Nihilism]] - You don't give a fuck about liberty, equality and justice, but we both like guns and drugs.


=== Enemies ===
===Enemies===
*[[File:Natlib.png]] [[National Libertarianism]] - How is this even libertarian?!
*[[File:Natlib.png]] [[National Libertarianism]] - How is this even libertarian?!
*[[File:Paleolib.png]] [[Paleolibertarianism]] - My strategy is way better!
*[[File:Paleolib.png]] [[Paleolibertarianism]] - My strategy is way better!
Line 124: Line 131:
*[[File:Korwinism-Pikselart.png]] [[Korwinism]] - For Pete's sake, PLEASE STOP CALLING ME A PEDOLIBERTARIAN! YOU'RE THE ONE WHO WANTS TO LEGALIZE CHILD PORNOGRAPHY!
*[[File:Korwinism-Pikselart.png]] [[Korwinism]] - For Pete's sake, PLEASE STOP CALLING ME A PEDOLIBERTARIAN! YOU'RE THE ONE WHO WANTS TO LEGALIZE CHILD PORNOGRAPHY!


== Further Information ==
==Further Information==
=== Literature ===
===Literature===
*[https://www.amazon.co.uk/Open-Borders-Science-Ethics-Immigration/dp/1250316979 Open Borders: The Science and Ethics of Immigration] ([https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Open_Borders.html?id=FUa0DwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false Preview])
*[https://www.amazon.co.uk/Open-Borders-Science-Ethics-Immigration/dp/1250316979 Open Borders: The Science and Ethics of Immigration] ([https://books.google.co.uk/books/about/Open_Borders.html?id=FUa0DwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=kp_read_button&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false Preview])


=== Wikipedia ===
===Wikipedia===
*[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoclassical_liberalism Bleeding Heart Libertarianism]
*[[w:Neoclassical_liberalism|Bleeding Heart Libertarianism]]
*[[File:Cball-Lithuania.png]] [[w:Freedom Party (Lithuania)|Freedom Party]]
*[[File:Cball-Lithuania.png]] [[w:Freedom Party (Lithuania)|Freedom Party]]


=== Websites ===
===Websites===


* [https://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/ bleedingheartlibertarianism.com]
* [https://bleedingheartlibertarians.com/ bleedingheartlibertarianism.com]


=== Videos ===
===Videos===
*[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca0gzxTuoVo Open Borders- The Science and Ethics of Immigration] by [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7plifM6HI2j9pL5oTmWfpw Students of Liberty Mercer]
*[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ca0gzxTuoVo Open Borders- The Science and Ethics of Immigration] by [https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7plifM6HI2j9pL5oTmWfpw Students of Liberty Mercer]
=== Online Communities ===
===Online Communities===
*[https://www.reddit.com/r/BHL/ r/BHL]
*[https://www.reddit.com/r/BHL/ r/BHL]


== Gallery ==
==Gallery==
<gallery widths="185">
<gallery widths="185">
Heartbert-staswalle.png|Original infobox image
Heartbert-staswalle.png|Original infobox image
Line 157: Line 164:
{{Navbox/Libertarians}}
{{Navbox/Libertarians}}
{{Navbox/Prefixes}}
{{Navbox/Prefixes}}
[[Category:Libertarian Right]]
[[Category:Libertarian Right]]
[[Category:Libertarian Unity]]
[[Category:Libertarian Unity]]
Line 164: Line 170:
[[Category:Internationalists]]
[[Category:Internationalists]]
[[Category:Capitalists]]
[[Category:Capitalists]]
[[zh:自由意志进步主义]]

Latest revision as of 10:38, 20 November 2024

Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism (Heartbert) also known as Neoclassical Liberalism (Neoclasslib) is a Culturally Left, Economically Center-Right to Right(usually under Chicago school of economics, mostly because it's more politically correct), Libertarian Ideology who is the child of Libertarianism and Progressivism. Heartbert believes that negative rights and free markets are compatible, and are also complementary to the concept of Social Justice.

Beliefs

Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism believes that the best way to empower the socially disadvantaged is through the upholding of civil liberties. Economically, it ranges from a social market economy to a free market economy. It sees economic liberalism and cultural liberalism as going hand-in-hand with each other to achieve these ideological adjectives.

History

Laisvės partija

Laisvės partija (Freedom Party) is a Lithuanian party that emerged in 2019, in which the president is the current Minister of Economy and Innovation Aušrinė Armonaitė and the party's deputy is the current Mayor of Vilnius and has 11 members of the Seimas.

Its ideals are based on LGBT rights, environmental preservation, carbon neutrality and control of global warming by 2040, fiscalism as opposed to tax increases, women's rights, pro-democracy, military service with civil service, pro-marijuana legalization, separate recognition of Taiwan and calls itself social liberal.

Personality and Behaviour

Heartbert within the comics is usually portrayed as a bit of an "SJW" stereotype within the context of other libertarians, meaning he will insist others not to use "politically incorrect language" and use the "correct pronouns".

How to Draw

Flag of Bleeding-Heart Libertarianism

Heartbert's design is that of Libertarianism with the snake replaced with a "Bleeding Heart".

  1. Draw a ball
  2. Fill it gold
  3. Draw a black Heart
  4. From the heart draw black "blood" coming out
  5. (Optional) Draw some variation of "Don't Tread on Me" or "No Step on Heart"

And you're done!

Color Name HEX RGB
Yellow #F5DD02 245, 221, 2
Black #141414 20, 20, 20


Relationships

Friends

Frenemies

  • Libertarian Conservatism - I may not like your cultural policies, but we still stand for liberty!
  • Populism - I like that you care about the people, but I don’t think your strategies are the best.
  • Neoliberalism - I'd like to think you're just a more moderate version of me, but that military interventionism of yours makes me think otherwise...
  • Libertarian Socialism - STINKY SOCIALIST!!! But at least you're a libertarian and socially progressive.
  • State Liberalism - I applaud your advocacy for the LGBTQ community. You are also a capitalist which is cool too. But you take things WAY too far. You also need cut the authoritarian shit.
  • Anarcho-Nihilism - You don't give a fuck about liberty, equality and justice, but we both like guns and drugs.

Enemies

Further Information

Literature

Wikipedia

Websites

Videos

Online Communities

Gallery

  • Original infobox image

    Original infobox image

  • u/Eu_Sou_BR Source

    u/Eu_Sou_BR Source

Navigation

Template:Navbox/Prefixes

zh:自由意志进步主义

Retrieved from "https://pcbwiki.net/index.php?title=Bleeding-Heart_Libertarianism&oldid=528909"

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